Does God Really “Allow” Evil?

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In a discussion about Katrina, a commenter alluded to the age-old question, how could a powerful and good God have allowed so much suffering? Before we can credibly explore that question, we have to confront a preliminary topic.

We can’t very well say that God allows suffering unless we’re confident that he could have acted to prevent it. But Christianity and other religions haven’t done a good job of explaining (at least not plausibly) how God might intervene in the world. There seems to be a spectrum of belief:

At one extreme is hard-core deism: God supposedly set the universe in motion like a wind-up toy, and has been more or less letting it run by itself ever since. In theory, this view absolves God, at least to a certain extent, of any moral responsibility for suffering. .
At another extreme is hard-core theism: Everything that happens in this world
results from God somehow pushing buttons, pulling levers, and otherwise manipulating his creation to make it so. A lot of Christians seem to believe this; every time something good or bad happens, they attribute it to God’s action, or at least to his will.
Then there are the folks who doubt God’s omnipotence and question whether he even has the power to intervene in the world in the way we might wish he would. Political and social commentator Gregg Easterbrook addresses this question in his intriguing book, Beside Still Waters.

Unfortunately, too many otherwise-faithful Christians assert beliefs like this without ever asking whether those beliefs are supported by evidence — the revelation of what God (by hypothesis) has actually done, as distinct from we wish, or hope, he has done.

Comments

8 responses to “Does God Really “Allow” Evil?”

2005-09-16

derek

I posted on this very topic a few days ago but it is a perennial question in the face of the embodied world. I don’t know that I deal with “evidence” in a way that you would find satisfactory… 😉

Reply
2005-09-17

Anon

Since everyone has abandoned the discussion in the Real Katrina thread, I’ll post this here.
This is a confession of sorts.
About two decades ago, to the day, I was at university and had the umpteenth breakup with my then girl-friend. It was a very volatile relationship in which I would dump her every time she drove me past the point of sanity. That woman could drive me crazy like no other.
So one day, after “ending” it between us yet again, I felt remorse and a genuine longing to talk to her. But pride stopped me from calling her. I was afraid that she’d tell me to go stuff myself. Then my mind concocted a solution. I went down to the covered parking she always used when on campus and let the air out of her front left tire. I then returned to my office on campus (that’s a long story) and sat down next to the phone.
Within an hour the phone rang. It was her calling to ask for help in putting on the spare.
I acted the part of the saintly good samaritan perfectly, went down and changed the wheel, and then basked in the glory of being the hero who “saved” her.
Where am I going with this? You’ll see now.
Isn’t bible god the same as me back then? I mean he creates the world in such a way that everything will go to pot and the inhabitants will become weak, wretched and immoral creatures who deserve only eternal torture on the hell-fires.
Then he steps in and “saves” us all by sending his son down to die on the cross for us.
Then like my ex girl-friend, we are supposed to be grateful??
Well, let me tell you about my ex. Yes, she was grateful for my help…for about 30 minutes. Then she started asking me if I had let the air out of her tire in order to get a chance to be a hero. I denied doing so.
A lot of people who are not fundies look at the bible story and ask if the omniscient, omnipotent, and omnipresent god who designed the world (ie, created the problem in the first place) deserves any thanks when he puts on a big act in solving it.
Why am I here? I have a longing to believe in a god. Maybe there is one out there that we can’t really know?
But I seriously doubt that it’s the ancient Israeli war-god described in the buybull that so many Americans still believe in.
None of the explanations provided by the buybull make any sense. That’s why Fundies insist that you not think about it and just accept.

Reply
2005-09-17

Anon

One more fact to consider that will make my point all the more plausible. The bible continously describes bibe-god as a “jealous god” who quickly becomes angry and extremely violent whenever he feels humans are not worshipping him enough.
Wouldn’t such an insecure creature be highly likely to hatch a plot as described above to win the adoration of his creations?
I wouldn’t put it past him.

Reply
2005-09-17

Anon

There was a great piece in Harper’s last month, “The Christian Paradox: How a Faithful Nation Gets Jesus Wrong” by Bill McKibben, about how three out of four Americans believe the Bible teaches this: “God helps those who help themselves.” The Gospel according to Mark? Luke? Actually, it was Ben Franklin who came up with these words to live by.
“The thing is,” McKibben writes, “not only is Franklin’s wisdom not biblical; it’s counterbiblical. Few ideas could be further from the gospel message, with its radical summons to love of neighbor. On this essential matter, most Americans—most American Christians—are simply wrong, as if 75 percent of American scientists believed that Newton proved gravity causes apples to fly up.”
Now, in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, we have seen—and been unable to look away from— the direct result of this self-deception.
Rest of article at
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9342324/site/newsweek/

Reply
2005-09-17

Anon

There was a great piece in Harper’s last month, “The Christian Paradox: How a Faithful Nation Gets Jesus Wrong” by Bill McKibben, about how three out of four Americans believe the Bible teaches this: “God helps those who help themselves.” The Gospel according to Mark? Luke? Actually, it was Ben Franklin who came up with these words to live by.
“The thing is,” McKibben writes, “not only is Franklin’s wisdom not biblical; it’s counterbiblical. Few ideas could be further from the gospel message, with its radical summons to love of neighbor. On this essential matter, most Americans—most American Christians—are simply wrong, as if 75 percent of American scientists believed that Newton proved gravity causes apples to fly up.”
Now, in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina, we have seen—and been unable to look away from— the direct result of this self-deception.
Rest of article at
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9342324/site/newsweek/

Reply
2005-09-17

D. C.

Anon says: “Why am I here? I have a longing to believe in a god. Maybe there is one out there that we can’t really know? But I seriously doubt that it’s the ancient Israeli[te] war-god described in the buybull that so many Americans still believe in.”
Anon, many so-called liberal Christians share your doubts about the Israelite war-god. Assuming arguendo that God exists, he is what he is, not what we presume to make him.
As to your longing to believe in a god, I sympathize; I was in the same boat for decades. I wanted to believe, but I could not give my personal assent to doctrines about God that simply didn’t square with everything else we know about the world (which, by hypothesis, God created). It struck me as lacking integrity.

Reply
2005-09-17

Anon

Thank you for letting me post here. Most religious sites immediately ban anyone who doesn’t fully “toe the party line”.
I have been meditating on god and religion a great deal lately. I have even felt an urge to pray. But to what? I want to believe in a god that will make all this suffering pay off in the end.
On a side note, I have been struggling with depression over the past two years. But not being into pharmaceuticals, I have steadfastly avoided the various popular prescription drugs due to all their side effects. Then about three weeks ago another anon poster on a different board mentioned the dramatic results he had with his depression by taking 50 mg of 5-HTP a natural over-the-counter product which boosts serotonin levels. The next day I bought a bottle of 60 for $15. Within a week I was feeling happier and lighter. It also suppresses appetite.
It’s been about two weeks on it and I am very happy with the results. It’s like the sun finally came out after two years.
I recommend that others try it too.
I only mention this because it seems that at least half the population is suffering from varying degrees of depression.
More here: http://www.ceri.com/rev-sero.htm

Reply
2005-09-17

D. C.

Anon writes: “I have been meditating on god and religion a great deal lately. I have even felt an urge to pray. But to what? I want to believe in a god that will make all this suffering pay off in the end.”
You might take a look at the last few paragraphs of The Fifth Stage of Crisis Management, which I posted a couple of hours ago. I don’t claim it has a perfect answer to the problem of suffering, but what I’ve been able to come up with is plausible enough that I can at least provisionally believe it.

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